Waterless coolent

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Mark T Boldry
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:28 pm
Name: Mark T Boldry
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia.
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Re: Waterless coolent

Postby Mark T Boldry » Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:33 am

Dave T.

I'm sure that there are many that will agree with you, I have a great friend with an MGA who will just NOT use Evans), however, the fear of 'overheating' an engine is set in our minds due to the fact that water boils at 100 degrees C (212 degrees F) and to us that is the 'critical' point. An engine will run at it's best efficiency at 100 degrees C but with a water based coolant, you can't do this, so we have to control this with seriously pressurised systems.. Evans allows the engine to run safely at and over 100 degrees C.

As mentioned above, we've had no problems with any vehicle that we've installed Evans into and in every day temps in the +30 degrees C range, 'overheating' here is a hot topic of conversation.

Yes Evans will not transfer heat as well as water (very little will) but when water boils, it's ability to transfer heat is reduced to circa 4% only…! Evans will continue to be effective up to 190 degrees C, a temperature you'll never reach.

I'm sticking with my choice…. Evans Waterless Engine Coolant.

Mark.

Otto
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2012 10:25 am
Name: Franz Otto

Re: Waterless coolent

Postby Otto » Sat Apr 19, 2014 7:48 pm

I initiated the discussion and want to report about my experience with Evans in my TE 21. I used it as described in the instructions after trying to get out every drop of water with the prep fluid.

My first experience was, that I hat to tighten some pipes, because they started leaking with the waterless cooling.

First driving experiences were without any problems, although the temperature gauge indicated a higher temperature than before (approx. 5 degrees).

Some month later we went for the "Alvis crossing borders" event. It was a really hot day (more than 30 degrees). After around 100 km with partly stop and go on the highway we hat to stop to get some fuel. I immediately opened the bonnet and kept the kenlowe fan running. Nevertheless the indicated engine temperature jumped up to never seen regions. after restarting the temperature gauge did not work any more and I faced fuel starvation worse than ever before. Next day even the kenlowe sensor gave up.

It seemed that the cooling effectiveness of the waterless cooling is really much lower than water mixed with anti freeze. The engine is not boiling, but runs on a much higher temperature.

After this experience I changed to water with anti freeze again, because I am afraid to kill the engine. It was an expensive experience, which I cannot recommend. Some of you perhaps remember the words from experienced club members "Alvis knows it best". There is no way around a good cleaned engine and cooling system.

RichardWallach
Posts: 350
Joined: Mon May 21, 2012 10:14 am
Name: Richard Wallach
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: Waterless coolent

Postby RichardWallach » Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:06 am

As an adjunct to the efficacy of waterless coolant I have found the Penrite products to be excellent. I appreciate that the climate in Australia is vastly different, the issue here being one of high temperatures. To that end Penrite 10 Tenths Race Coolant (whilst not waterless) has been excellent. I have a standard early TA21 and have not experienced any overheating difficulties even on days that I would consider to be hot, namely something over 90 degrees F.

A description of their products can be found at:
http://www.penriteoil.com.au/products.p ... roducts=98

Richard (Melbourne)

pdadd
Posts: 26
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 12:13 pm
Name: Philip Dadd

Re: Waterless coolant

Postby pdadd » Thu Oct 30, 2014 7:57 am

Gentlemen, may I join in the discussion?
Here in OZ there are two products, each claiming the same end result. I don't want to discuss the benefits or otherwise of the Evans product when compared with Liquid Intelligence which I think is manufactured here in Sydney. I have read the testimonials from a huge number of people, all of them extolling the benefits in temperature control, corrosion retardant etc. I have spoken with the manufacturer, but I am still to get an answer to my question --- does it assist in controlling petrol vaporization?
I contend that modern petrol has been altered to suit modern fuel injected vehicles, resulting in a situation where, in our cars, the fuel vaporises within minutes if the engine is turned off, I have a TA21 DHC. It has been thoroughly cleaned with Rydlyme, the radiator is clean and not blocked. It is fitted with an electric fan, water pump and heat shield. On the road it runs at a constant 75C, but when turned off the temperature gauge rises to 90 to 100C. If allowed to stand for more than 10 minutes, it is difficult to start, then coughs and splutters until the lines are clear of the vaporised fuel.
Clearly modern day petrol is too volatile for our cars. Has anyone who has, or is using the Evans or Liquid Intelligence product, found that it is beneficial in controlling petrol vaporization?
I note from the various articles that if we add Kerosine or paraffin at levels from 5% to 50% this will overcome the vaporization, but it will also put us back to the days of a valve grind and de-coke every 5,000 miles or so! (not even thinking about the burnt valves and all the things we had in the "good old days").
I currently run with distilled water and the Redline product "Waterwetter" and have fitted an overflow bottle combined with a two way relief valve in the radiator.
To answer an earlier question; to completely drain all the water from the engine block and radiator, raise the back wheels higher than the drain points and this (should) get sufficient water out to allow the Waterless coolant to be used without contamination.
The use of the Prep Solution is absolutely essential.
Phil. (Sydney Australia)

RichardWallach
Posts: 350
Joined: Mon May 21, 2012 10:14 am
Name: Richard Wallach
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: Waterless coolent

Postby RichardWallach » Thu Oct 30, 2014 9:39 pm

Phil,
My TA21 is stock standard in every way. It too runs at about 75 degrees with a full flow thermostat. On any day the temperature gauge will also rise to about 90 degrees after the motor is switched off, however it falls away quite quickly after about 10 minutes. Re-starting poses no problem. The temperature gauge pick up unit is at the back of the motor and probably indicates a temperature higher than that at the front. The fuel line is more exposed and cools quicker. I still use the Penrite coolant and to my mind it is excellent. Is it worth insulating the fuel line - just a thought? Is a "cooler" thermostat an option? Are the side vents open? Are the rubber snubbers still in place at the windscreen end of the bonnet?

Richard
Melbourne

pdadd
Posts: 26
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 12:13 pm
Name: Philip Dadd

Re: Waterless coolent

Postby pdadd » Fri Oct 31, 2014 9:19 pm

Thanks Richard,
I didn't know about the Penrite product, so will look at their literature.
In my discussion with the Liquid Intelligence people they said to expect an up to 10C increase in temperature when using their product. I had been using an 85 C thermostat, but recently changed to one of 75C -- very difficult to find. I have also reduced the Electric fan to a 75C turn on temperature. I removed the rubber stops at the rear of the engine bonnet years ago as I thought that they were effective only when the car was running, and this is not where the problem occurs. I have also re-routed the fuel line and run it on the near side of the car --the opposite to that which is standard. Doing this I use an electronic fuel pump. The line goes nowhere near the engine until it reaches to Carbs. Yes, I did think to remove the mechanical petrol pump!
It appears from all the comments listed in this forum that Waterless Coolant, regardless of it's source (I prefer to use Australian made products to support whatever we have left of our automotive industry) will have no benefits so far as fuel vaporization is concerned. There is an interesting article on fuel vaporization in (I think) the MG TABC discussion Forum where they have compared an MG TC with a MG TA using various fuel richness settings.
Once again, thanks for your input.
Phil. ACC Sydney

RichardWallach
Posts: 350
Joined: Mon May 21, 2012 10:14 am
Name: Richard Wallach
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: Waterless coolent

Postby RichardWallach » Fri Oct 31, 2014 11:29 pm

Phil,

I use a 82C/180/F thermostat and the temp gauge sits around 75 degrees. I would recommend a high flow type as they have a larger throat diameter They are quite readily available. The brand is Tridon made by Motorad. The part number for mine is TT 2040 -180.

The 71C degree model has the part number TT2000-160.

It is interesting to note that Nick Simpson recommended a 60 degree C thermostat.
With respect to the rubber stops, the gap they leave does allow for a lot of heat to escape when stationary. I can feel heat escape when I place my hand near the windscreen. I have seen these advertised on e-bay. Clark Rubber stock a very similar product.

With respect to the coolant see: http://www.penriteoil.com.au/tech_pdfs_ ... olants.pdf
I use the race coolant.

With respect to your full pump can you provide specifics. Is it an SU pump, push/pull, location etc????

Richard
Melbourne

pdadd
Posts: 26
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 12:13 pm
Name: Philip Dadd

Re: Waterless coolent

Postby pdadd » Sun Nov 16, 2014 11:56 am

Richard,
I use a Facet Solid State pump. originally it was fitted as a primer, ie after the car has sat for a day or week, I simply turn on pump, it primes the AC mechanical pump and the carbs and the engine fires immediately. On the 40 degree days, particularly when I'm in heavy traffic I turn the Facet on and there is no sign of fuel starvation. For a time I disconnected the mechanical pump and used the Facet as the only pump. The pump is fitted on the right hand chassis rail just below the level of the petrol tank. Hope this helps.
Phil,
Sydney

RichardWallach
Posts: 350
Joined: Mon May 21, 2012 10:14 am
Name: Richard Wallach
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: Waterless coolent

Postby RichardWallach » Mon Nov 17, 2014 6:12 am

Thanks Philip.

Any outcome yet with respect to the issues you are facing?

Richard
Melbourne


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